OOC Thread #2

[august]

I'd like to point out that Arc-Royal hasn't effectively declared independence. The claim was a bit more subtle - we declared the Articles of Acceptance void for the whole Commonwealth and the Estates General claims to be the sovereign body operating without a constitution at present. If I've been using the admittedly clumsy name "The Estates General of the Arc-Royal Territories and the Other Lyran Territories," it's for that reason. Arc-Royal is still claiming authority over Lyran Worlds, but not as the Lyran Commonwealth of old. There's a tacit acknowledgement there that most of those "Other Lyran Territories" don't give a damn what the Estates may say, but that doesn't mean that they're off the hook entirely. It is hair-splitting, and legally questionable through and through, but is defining some worlds (how many? depends on how many times I think it's convenient) as Lyran on historical and national bases rather than explicitly de facto political ones.

[NVA]

You claim to have dissolved the Lyran state.  Ergo, the Lyran state, per Arc Royal, is not part of the Star League anymore <see RD and HA for what happens when the previous body ceases to exist and becomes a new body.>

Also, you threatened to blow up the Commanding General.  Any officer of Arc Royal units is likely to face criminal charges of SOME kind if they land on Terra. 

I'd like to point out that Arc-Royal hasn't effectively declared independence. The claim was a bit more subtle - we declared the Articles of Acceptance void for the whole Commonwealth and the Estates General claims to be the sovereign body operating without a constitution at present. If I've been using the admittedly clumsy name "The Estates General of the Arc-Royal Territories and the Other Lyran Territories," it's for that reason. Arc-Royal is still claiming authority over Lyran Worlds, but not as the Lyran Commonwealth of old. There's a tacit acknowledgement there that most of those "Other Lyran Territories" don't give a damn what the Estates may say, but that doesn't mean that they're off the hook entirely. It is hair-splitting, and legally questionable through and through, but is defining some worlds (how many? depends on how many times I think it's convenient) as Lyran on historical and national bases rather than explicitly de facto political ones.

[august]

Oh, doubtlessly and I would deserve and expect such treatment. I'm not arguing that A-R should be let into the meeting; they're likely not to come even if invited. Just wanted to clarify the position.

You claim to have dissolved the Lyran state.  Ergo, the Lyran state, per Arc Royal, is not part of the Star League anymore <see RD and HA for what happens when the previous body ceases to exist and becomes a new body.>

Also, you threatened to blow up the Commanding General.  Any officer of Arc Royal units is likely to face criminal charges of SOME kind if they land on Terra. 

[chaosxtreme]

You claim to have dissolved the Lyran state.  Ergo, the Lyran state, per Arc Royal, is not part of the Star League anymore <see RD and HA for what happens when the previous body ceases to exist and becomes a new body.>

Also, you threatened to blow up the Commanding General.  Any officer of Arc Royal units is likely to face criminal charges of SOME kind if they land on Terra. 

I'd like to point out that Arc-Royal hasn't effectively declared independence. The claim was a bit more subtle - we declared the Articles of Acceptance void for the whole Commonwealth and the Estates General claims to be the sovereign body operating without a constitution at present. If I've been using the admittedly clumsy name "The Estates General of the Arc-Royal Territories and the Other Lyran Territories," it's for that reason. Arc-Royal is still claiming authority over Lyran Worlds, but not as the Lyran Commonwealth of old. There's a tacit acknowledgement there that most of those "Other Lyran Territories" don't give a damn what the Estates may say, but that doesn't mean that they're off the hook entirely. It is hair-splitting, and legally questionable through and through, but is defining some worlds (how many? depends on how many times I think it's convenient) as Lyran on historical and national bases rather than explicitly de facto political ones.

Not if some SL Member state gave them diplomatic immunity for their visit in a official capacity. :-)

[NVA]

Except, a single state cannot do that, except the TH.  Cause, the Terran Hegemony houses the Star League Council and Defense Force HQ.  So, to come visit, the TH would have to grant them DI. 

[chaosxtreme]

Your incorrect its been done before Inchar.

when the Rimmers showed up to Address the SLHC and First Lord it was facilitated entirely by the FWL.

Precedent has been set. :-)

[NVA]

Well, one could try it again.  No one challenged it then. 

Your incorrect its been done before Inchar.

when the Rimmers showed up to Address the SLHC and First Lord it was facilitated entirely by the FWL.

Precedent has been set. :-)

[DXM]

I'm curious, NVA, why your in-character mindset is one of RWR = bad.  It's not like they killed Morgan Kell or attacked Wolf assets; in point of fact, in one of the combat threads, I believe I said something about welcoming your presence on my worlds.

[Cannonshop]

I'm curious, NVA, why your in-character mindset is one of RWR = bad.  It's not like they killed Morgan Kell or attacked Wolf assets; in point of fact, in one of the combat threads, I believe I said something about welcoming your presence on my worlds.

I suspect the IC answer works something like this:
Name+Lineage, plus the WiE were one of (what, three?) "Powers" present in the Plague zone during the Flu, and they saw the same evidence that the Arlunans and Kowloonese did-fortunately, they didn't draw the same conclusions to the same extreme that the locals did, or there would have been...problems for the Rim Worlds beyond the problems they already face.  Instead, the Wolves are 'fence sitting' WRT the RWR, but that doesn't translate into outright endorsements-yet.

Hence, on some subjects, you're still wearing a plutonium medallion on a byrillium chain.  Fortunately for your future diplomacy, Arc Royal's the one that's shown up to the dance wearing an explosive suicide vest while singing the Horst Wessel song.


Now, it's perfectly reasonable that nobody in their right mind on the Star League side has invited the UIW to any big-shot meetings on Terra, after all, they're small, isolated, and relatively poor.  If anything, there may be bookies running odds on how long they last, but nobody's going to seriously consider the Independents to be much use as allies, but having htem in possession of strategic planning by the SLDF represents an actual security threat-because they could be over-run at any time by the Clans on three of their borders, and the hard numbers available don't give them much chance to survive it, much less drive invaders out.

[NVA]

I'm curious, NVA, why your in-character mindset is one of RWR = bad.  It's not like they killed Morgan Kell or attacked Wolf assets; in point of fact, in one of the combat threads, I believe I said something about welcoming your presence on my worlds.

The UIW is also know to be buddy buddy with some of the enemy clans.  So, similar reasoning to why the MoC is not present. 

As for the RWR, CS hit on most of it.  Plus the fact that you are stealing troops needed from the Lyrans, an expectation that because of who you claim to be, the clans will be on your doorstep, etc.  IC, if the RWR and the clans grind on each other a bit, good. 

[august]

I'm curious, NVA, why your in-character mindset is one of RWR = bad.  It's not like they killed Morgan Kell ..

Is it too late to blame you for that? 

[NVA]

I'm curious, NVA, why your in-character mindset is one of RWR = bad.  It's not like they killed Morgan Kell ..

Is it too late to blame you for that? 

Of course not.  You just need to convince people that the Martyrs are really a Daphne Rowe group that was used to destabalize the Commonwealth.  That they set up Morgan Kell to fall, to cause more issues.  One thing DXM may not realize is that Daphne Rowe and her RWR are seen as worse than the clans in some places.  She and Adam destabalized the Commonwealth in their grab for power.  So, most blame of what is going on now can reasonably be pointed at those two.

[chaosxtreme]

I'm curious, NVA, why your in-character mindset is one of RWR = bad.  It's not like they killed Morgan Kell ..

Is it too late to blame you for that? 

Of course not.  You just need to convince people that the Martyrs are really a Daphne Rowe group that was used to destabalize the Commonwealth.  That they set up Morgan Kell to fall, to cause more issues.  One thing DXM may not realize is that Daphne Rowe and her RWR are seen as worse than the clans in some places.  She and Adam destabalized the Commonwealth in their grab for power.  So, most blame of what is going on now can reasonably be pointed at those two.

Which could be one reason why her and her beau are so popular in the Free Worlds League.

"But they killed a lot of Elsies!" May be a rallying cry in the FWL but its not one for a lynching more like the cause of a ticker tape parade.

[DXM]

Fair enough.

[DisGruntled]

We can help you fix that chaos, I know we have a few Arluna "blankets" tucked away somewhere...