Rules Questions and Comments

[Daemonknight]

There is indeed a Pirate Point Insertion, under the Movement Rules section. If you fail your Pirate insertion(but roll higher than a 3), the enemy is able to intercept you. A 3 means 50% of your force's FP is lost, a 2 means your whole force is lost, due to misjumps.

[Fatebringer]

Understood, I suspected that chart was under the Tables section of Combat Rules with the rest of them, No wonder I never found it

[Fatebringer]

I thought it was better than the Transit chart I made some of my pirate rolls than,.

[Fatebringer]

Forgot their is no more raid transit rolls, only pirate.

If there are no more Raid Transit Rolls, then why is there a chart?

[Daemonknight]

You choose which type you wish to make. You have a slightly better chance of making your Pirate Insertion, but you risk losing some/all of your forces. Raid Transit is a simple pass/fail, with failure resulting in the same thing as failed Pirate Insertion: defending forces can block you. Also, successful Pirate Insertion during a raid applies a -2 to the enemy force's Raid Defense roll.

Also, you can only intercept a raid with ASF if the raid fails its insertion roll(either type), OR, if the raid targets a SS or SY(can only target such facilities with ASF or Marines)

[Parmenion]

Folks,

I'd like to take this opportunity to talk about the unit Training rule, as per:

http://intelser.org/forums/index.php?topic=2643.0

Currently, factions can only train up one unit per turn, however I find this rule more than slightly bizarre.  I see no valid reason why a faction cannot train up more than one unit in a cycle other than to impose some sort of skill limitation.   If a faction undertook a multi world offensive (which we see all the time in this game), then they could conceivably have 20-30 regiments or clusters to train up (mostly from regular to veteran).  Even with only 20 units, that is nearly three and a half years of game time till the last unit is raised to veteran level. 

A case in point would be a Davion style RCT, with the following:

Mech regiment
3x armoured regiments
1x Battlearmour regiment
4x mechanized infantry regiments
2x ASF wings. 

That's 11 cycles just for the one formation. 

I would like to hear players thoughts on this and whether training should be open as required, or perhaps an upper limit of say 10 regiments/clusters per cycle just to give some sort of limitation, without being so very restrictive as it is at present.

[Fatebringer]

One thing I made sure to take advantage of during the time jump was to train up units. Even units I just made, I figured depending on their creation date in 20 years, there was still a chance for combat given border trails with the Hellions, Falcons and occasional raids, incursions with the DC.

Before the Jump, I kept notes of what battles certain ships, units participated in. I still do, but I cleared the board for most of those units with the time jump forward. Units that had 2 battles under their belt I figured would get a third and I trained to Elite and made notes for the GMs.

I think a limit of 10 clusters, regiments a cycle is a bit high, maybe 2 or 3 and the only reason I say this is to offset the skill reduction possibility on repairs.

[Dave Baughman]

Before my free time evaporated and I had to turn over the reigns, I was planning on changing training so that it could be done more than once per turn, as part an overall revision of the R&D rules. The rule was a little more complex than it is now but it basically boiled down to allowing one training project per PF (assuming you did no other R&D jobs that turn). So... I'm all in favor of loosening the 1 training per turn rule.

Alternately, IIRC Flashpoint did away with training restrictions alltogether and instead required a roll that had a progressively higher difficulty for each skill rank. That might be an alternate approach.

[Fatebringer]

And a Bunch of money

I like the idea of limiting things to the number of PF's a faction can do as "Specials" the idea of giving the PF a bigger role in the game makes it worth targeting.

Require a number of SP for creating a Nuke in addition to the RP cost. "Nuke cost 25 FP, 5 SP"? Add SP cost to making Spec Ops Teams or use them to reduce time?Instead of 12 RP over 6 Turns, 6 RP and 3 SP over 3 turns? Progressive SP cost + GM approval for Elite for the Training? Spend SP points for Tech and somehow link this into R&D? Just spewing ideas

[Parmenion]

Before my free time evaporated and I had to turn over the reigns, I was planning on changing training so that it could be done more than once per turn, as part an overall revision of the R&D rules. The rule was a little more complex than it is now but it basically boiled down to allowing one training project per PF (assuming you did no other R&D jobs that turn). So... I'm all in favor of loosening the 1 training per turn rule.

I see where you are coming from ADB, however I think this idea of yours could be expanded on.

For instance, the Davions might want to train one of their mechanized infantry regiments from an RCT.  That would be anywhere from 2FP to say 5FP (for example).  On the other end of the scale, the Dracs want to train up one of their mega regiments worth 60FP.  The Combine is certainly getting more value out of their PF than the Davions.

So how about instead that each PF supports the training of 'XX' FP per cycle.  If it is 20FP, then if you have 3PF, then you could train up to 60FP worth of units. 

[GreyJaeger]

Before my free time evaporated and I had to turn over the reigns, I was planning on changing training so that it could be done more than once per turn, as part an overall revision of the R&D rules. The rule was a little more complex than it is now but it basically boiled down to allowing one training project per PF (assuming you did no other R&D jobs that turn). So... I'm all in favor of loosening the 1 training per turn rule.

I see where you are coming from ADB, however I think this idea of yours could be expanded on.

For instance, the Davions might want to train one of their mechanized infantry regiments from an RCT.  That would be anywhere from 2FP to say 5FP (for example).  On the other end of the scale, the Dracs want to train up one of their mega regiments worth 60FP.  The Combine is certainly getting more value out of their PF than the Davions.

So how about instead that each PF supports the training of 'XX' FP per cycle.  If it is 20FP, then if you have 3PF, then you could train up to 60FP worth of units. 

Of course, the rules for acquiring PFs need to be redone as well.

[Daemonknight]

in the new game, PFs are built just like any other hex improvement. they are just extremely expensive

[Parmenion]

in the new game, PFs are built just like any other hex improvement. they are just extremely expensive

but that doesn't add value to the question I posed above, since it's only a hypothetical game (at this point in time). 

[Daemonknight]

Well, 2 things. First, its not a hypothetical game; that implies it will never be played. Its the replacement for the current game. And second- I don't see an actual question, so i fail to see what 'adding value' has to do with anything.

For that matter, my comment wasn't directed at you. Grey said the rules for building PFs need to be addressed, thats what my comment was in reference to.

To address your initial 'discussion', in terms of the rules that're being worked on: training units in the new game is quite simple. You can train a unit anywhere you wish, so long as you pay the fee, and the unit is unavailable for ANY combat actions that turn, unless you wish to waste the turn(and money).

Ex: CJF is training the Falcon Guards from Veteran to Elite, on Sudeten. They pay the cost, and the Guards are stationary for a turn. However, the Wolves launch a trial on Sudeten, and the Guards are needed to defend it. Because they are supposed to be training, and must break off that action, the money spent is lost, and the unit remains at Veteran, but it is allowed to defend the planet that turn.

You can train as many units as you want per turn aswell. However, there is a strict hierarchy in place. You need to have 'X' Regular units to support a single Veteran. And 'Y' Veteran units to support an Elite.

For the IS, each faction will have 2-3 very special formations that can move above Elite(to Heroic). The Clans have a similar number of units who can go upto Legendary.

[chaosxtreme]

Should also apply for Green units to support regular.

I mean I understand nobody like's the greenies but the idea that all our units are regular or better is a little silly. :-) There has to be units for people to cut their teeth in and to threaten to send the fuckup's. :-)